Famous Car Salesman Arguments. Why they think its ok to screw you.

Alright, I’ve compiled a list of Car Salesman Arguments. These arguments are often presented when you are either buying a car, or talking badly about car salespeople on an internet site. Salespeople in this industry are instructed to be very vocal about how bad you’re hurting their pockets when you ask for a deal. Sounds Kinda Screwy? I think so too.

1. You wouldn’t haggle on the price of groceries!!!!

You are right, I wouldn’t. Because if I went to the manager and asked for $1 off of my gallon of milk, he would laugh at me and probably ask me to leave. So, with that said, how come I don’t get the same response when I ask for $1000 at a car dealership? Simple. I need milk. Lots of it. Lots of people need milk honestly. Not everyone needs to buy a car. Plus, a grocery store does not stand to make a profit margin like that of a car. When the salesman uses this tactic, say something witty like “If I knew the grocery store would cave in as easily as you will, I would haggle for my groceries too” That usually gets a rise out of them.

2. Car salesman will often tell you how bad it affects them when you ask for a discount, usually with something like “Would you work for free?”

No, thats silly. No one would work for free. The dealership pays you minimum wage (or more) and although its usually a draw that you pay back, you NEVER work for free. What they omit is that no matter what they sell the car for, there is always a FLAT FEE that they will get (typically $100) either way. So no, I would not work for free, and neither do you. When they use this tactic offer to call the labor board on their behalf, because you think its terrible that they’re not getting paid! This almost always shuts them up.

3. Car Salesmen often will say “Theres just not that much profit”

Well, I’m glad you mentioned that, lets talk about it. Who gets paid. Well, first the manufacturer makes their profit by selling the cars to the dealership in bulk. Next the shop makes money by preparing the car to be sold (which adds a “pack” to the car that YOU the consumer pay for). Next, the dealership usually “adds” several options onto the car like stupid pinstriping, or mudflaps and charges you 100% profit for. Then the dealership marks the car up to the “MSRP” which I refer to as Most Stupid Ridiculous Pricing. Depending on the make, there could be profits of $500 to $8000 (more in some cases) . So when someone tells you theres not enough profit in a car, you should Laugh Loudly.

4. Some will say “I’m an honest guy trying to make an honest living”

And its true, there are some genuinely good ol’ boys selling cars right now. Honest guys (who will honestly rob you blind) always willing to “make a deal”. Don’t believe the hype. Anyone who as any morals would not work in this industry. When the salesman claims he is an honest guy making an honest living, ask them to tell you the real amount they are giving you for your trade. This will usually end his “honesty kick”.

I hope this sheds a little light on the subject A Car Salesman’s Complaints and Arguments should always fall on deaf ears. They are only trying to get your money. Honestly.

Beat em’ up good,

Jason P

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259 Responses to “Famous Car Salesman Arguments. Why they think its ok to screw you.”

  1. Car Buying Tips, New & Used Car Sales, Autos Online » Famous Car Salesman Arguments. Why they think its ok to screw you. Says:

    […] deanbrooks posted a great article about car buying.Here’s a quick snippet.So, with that said, how come I don’t get the same response when I ask for $1000 at a car dealership? Simple. I need milk. Lots of it. Lots of people need milk honestly. Not everyone needs to buy a car. Plus, a grocery store does not … […]

  2. S Says:

    Oh man, I heard all of these when I bought my last car.

    I had the man so angry at me by the time I left with my car, I swear he cut his profit down to zero just to get me gone! 😛

  3. fuckshit Says:

    gr8 article

  4. enderbh Says:

    I would like to add a little insight here. As for domestic producers (Chevy, Ford, Chrysler), yes, they may knock your head off on a new car sale with $8000 in profit, or whatever. Of course, though, you did ask for it by both buying new, and buying domestic. As for foreign producers (Honda, Toyota, Nissan), the profit is rarely over $2000 on a new purchase. And put that into prospective: on a $20,000 purchase, that a 10% markup. What is the markup on a DVD or a can of Coke? Something like 1000%? Hell even furniture is typically marked up 50% or more.

    And then there is the issue of how many sales an average dealership makes in a month. Anywhere from 60 to 120 sales depending on the size of the dealership. After making payroll, your not making much more that the average restaurant, yet absorbing many risks not incurred by the average business. It is easy to pick on an industry that functions as one of the last pure forms of a free market economy, since your accustomed to not having a voice anywhere else. You get screwed about ten times worse on almost any other consumer good you purchase, including furniture, health insurance, consumer electronics, prescription drugs, clothing, etc. Hell, even the taxes you pay are a rip off (perhaps the biggest one). Yet ask yourself this: Why complain about one of the more fairly marked up of goods, and criticize one of the few marketplaces where the consumer still has a voice?

  5. Bill Says:

    My Father is a car salesman. He is one of the most honest and decent people on this earth. He used to have a high-paying career that was unfortunately outsourced. It was hard for him to find work because of his advanced age. He went into selling cars so he could support our family. He didn’t choose it, he does it because he has to. He fights with the management about the way the treat their customers every day. He honestly tries to give customers the best deal he can while simultaneously struggling with the measley $100 per car they give him. I take great offense at this article.

  6. honest abe Says:

    As a young and relatively new salesman, i tried to get into the car business many years ago. I was very successful with smaller products because I found that I could deal with people honestly, meet their needs with the products that I had to offer, and create a win-win situation: the customer’s needs are met, the company gets a sale, and I made a little commission.

    When I got into car sales, it was a completely different game. Every person I worked with was only out to rob every customer they found. Every customer I spoke to was certain I was out to rob them of every dollar they had. The entire business was about nothing more than taking every last dollar you could part from your “mark”.

    My point is this: it’s not that there are no honest car salesmen – it’s that the honest ones probably get tired of the accusations, and go do something else. It’s the ones who really are out to rob you that continue to work in that environment.

  7. John C. Randolph Says:

    If the other party in *any* transaction claims that they’re not making enough profit on the deal, then I’d just say “Well, sorry: I guess you don’t want to take the price I’m willing to offer. Better luck with the next prospect”.

    What the other party’s profit margin may be is of no interest to me in a single transaction.


  8. Anonymous Says:

    I work in the car sales and what you are doing is generalizing the entire industry thanks to some bad experiences. At my dealership the new vehicles are within $200 of the INVOICE price, not the MSRP.
    Used vehicles do have more profit in them; however, for trade in’s that will go to the auction (and not sit on the lot forever) we lose our tails! We use auction programs to see generally what a particular vehicle will sell for at auction to price a trade, most times we do not re-coupe our costs.
    I do not screw people (though I have seen salesmen for anything screw the uneducated). Do your homework people, research what it is that you want in a vehicle and find out what it should cost, and talk to someone who will understand your needs and wants. Car salesmen are nothing more than tour guides–if you have specific needs in a vehicle, they will show you the vehicle(s) to fit them.

  9. greg Says:

    So, by your own definition, you have no morals. And yet, I should listen to your advice about the second largest purchase I (and most people in the world) will ever make? I think not. By the way, I am not a car salesman. I could pick apart the rest of your “article”, but, seriously, who cares?

  10. name Says:

    This is stupid, and makes it sound like turning a profit is somehow evil. The truth is much simpler than that. If the car salesman didn’t have something you wanted, you wouldn’t talk to them.

    He needs to turn a profit to pay his bills and be open for the next guy who wants his service.

    But there’s some wiggle room in profit margin. Haggling over that wiggle room is not “screwing’ anybody.

    If you don’t like the price, don’t buy. And if the price you want is simply too low, the salesman won’t sell. Econ 101, folks.

  11. D-List Six Figure Blogger Says:

    Nice list. You should always negotiate when given the opportunity. They will never sell the car if they aren’t making money in some way.

  12. Allen Says:

    Sorry, but your advice is awful, and those who follow it will find themselves spending many many more hours looking for a car, than if they hadn’t walked in with the chip you put on their shoulder.

    A typical, average car dealership does NOT make enough money off of new car inventory to keep their doors open for ONE day. The markup on the average new car (average being from 10-30k is SLIM.

    Arguing to one-up the car salesman will only get you shown the door. Car salesmen have egos, just like you, and won’t deal with snide, uninformed dialog with ANY customer. They’ll tell you good luck, and send you on your way. Then you spend another few hours finding another dealership, picking the car, going into the office with the same result.

    Car dealerships make most of their money on REPAIRS, and you can choose to not have your car repaired by a highly qualified professional who KNOWS the car inside and out. You can go to a third party mechanic and take your chances, along with the cheaper prices.

    Next in line of profits is the USED cars on a dealers lot, and you CAN haggle it down, since they DO pay wholesale book for the cars, they expect to go through that ritual.

    But for NEW cars I’m telling you from experience, do NOT have that much of an upmarking as you seem to think.

    Your argument regarding your needing milk, is specious at BEST.

    If I told any of your readers either:

    1) Guess what? I’m boss of the world, and for the rest of your life, you’re not allowed to drink milk. Ever.


    2) Hey there! I’m still boss of everything, and I decree for the rest of your life, you cannot own or operate an automobile! Have a nice day!

    WHICH statement would unharness a more negative emotional response from the subject?

    MOST people would have a hard time losing a CAR. MOST people would do just fine never drinking milk. Many do.

    Bottom line is, you’re trying to teach people how to reinforce the cynicism of car salesmen, making a labourious process that much more unpleasant for both parties.

    Carsalesmen have to deal with an amazingly large share of complete assholes too, you know. It may be their job, but they are human, just like you, and the job of dealing with people such as you, day in and day out, is far from easy.

    I’ve worked in car sales. Some are sharks, some are great guys, some exploit “opportunities” just like a CEO at Boeing would exploit an opportunity, and they are no different than anyone else regarding whether or not they typically “stick it” to a customer.

    The fact is, the extremely SUCCESSFUL car salesmen, as any salesman will tell you, is to get REPEAT business from satisfied customers who the salesman has built a relationship with over the years.

    I know of one salesman who never “greets” customers. He’s always in his office calling back customers from 5 years ago, letting them know about any “specials” the dealership may be carrying. He sells a couple of cars a day, at least. The newer salesmen watch in awe as customers walk in, ask to see him, and walk out an hour later with a new car. They want to be like him, if you give them an even chance.

    If people go in like you suggest, the chance of a salesman developing a relationship with you is ZERO, to your and his long term detriment.

    Certainly, there are predatory assholes in the car biz, but why help them justify their decisions by being an asshole yourself?


    Find out the wholesale price of the car on one of numerous sites on the internet, tack on between $500-800 dollars to the wholesale price.
    Call around to dealerships, tell them you want to buy a car TODAY.
    The operative word is “TODAY.”

    Then tell them you have the wholesale price of the car, including the accessories, and you’re willing to pay whatever side up you decide, and can they meet that price before tax and license?

    If they say they can, get the salesman’s name, and if you’re that paranoid, ask to speak to the general manager and get him to back it up. Get his name, too.

    THEN you go in, and you’ve cut 95% of the bullshit at the get-go.

    No arguing like a bitch, sassing like a panty-waste. Just clarity from beginning, middle and end, before you’ve even stepped foot on the lot.

    You read this back to any car salesman, and 99% would go along with this advice. NONE would go along with your advice.

    Happy car buying.

  13. shaun Says:

    Ok I have been in sales a whopping total of a year but it has really changed my view on the whole “salesmen” stigma. I don’t expect to change your opinion about us cause we have had a bad rep for so long and yes there are people who are out there to try to take every thing you have and then some but most of us aren’t.
    Now as for the whole grocery store thing you are right you can’t go into most places and just assume they will give you a different price cause you don;t like it, you pay them what they ask you to pay because thats what they tell you to pay, it has nothing to do with there profit margins. If the dairy industry said were going to charge you 20 dollars for a gallon of milk guess what the store is not going to sell it for 20 dollars cause guess what they are a business to so they mark things up just like the car dealer does and guess what you would groan and complain but you would still buy a 25 dollar gallon of milk. So if you can’t negotiate the price of anything else that you buy in this world why should it be any different for a car if you can’t afford it guess what don’t buy it. i come from a family with very little money and guess what there where somethings in life that we really wanted but guess what we couldn’t afford it so guess what we didn’t get to buy them. if you can’ afford the car you want then you can’t buy that car you’ll either have to save up your money or look for something that is in your price range if all you can afford is that small car with no fancy features then don’t complain and beg me for a discount on the big fully deck out suv just buy the little car and be happy that you have a working vehicle.

    Your next point about not working for free. You know what your right we never really work for free yes there is a set commission that we receive if we sell something at sticker price and yes that drops with every dollar we take off for you but we still have a minimum that we are guaranteed by the dealership no matter what but you know what it’s not much, hundred dollars in most cases, so when you ask us to discount your vehicle you are basically asking us to give up a portion of our paycheck so that you didn’t have to spend more of yours tell me how thats fair. I don’t know what you do for a living but if your customer wanted you to give them half of your paycheck just so they could get a better price how would you feel.

    and as for the whole theres no profit in them, there really isn’t we just deal with bigger numbers so it looks bigger a 1,000 dollars is not that much when your .talking about at a 35,000-40,000 dollar car

    and the whole honest guy bit, yes there are some guys out there who are just flat out slim balls in our industry that will use and abuses every customer they get in search of that all mighty dollar. but for the most part we are just like you we get up in the morning and put on or shits and ties and go to work just like normal people and we spend all day trying to make a living just like you do, we give you a product that you want and in most cases need and we get paid for it just like you. You may not like that we take your hard earned money but we work that much harder for it and we give you a very valuable commodity in return.

    so i know that i probably have not changed any one’s mind about us but please try to see thing from our point of view next time you get flustered that were hesitant o discount that new car or truck for you. just remember that we are just normal people that are working for you to try and make a living just like every one else on the face of this planet.

  14. Brian Says:

    I’m sorry, but this is a load. I have NEVER taken the time to sit down and actually write on someone’s blog, but this is just plain silly and people are completly misguided if they believe any of this.

    Oh, and all of what I say is based off of working in the business office of a car dealership with 3 separate stores. So I see all the paperwork that is not available to the public so I do have some sense of what I am talking about.

    1. You wouldn’t haggle on the price of groceries!!!!
    Retarded. If a salesmen tells you this, then just leave. That’s a false analogy. And he probably won’t know what he means if you tell him this.

    2. Car salesman will often tell you how bad it affects them when you ask for a discount, usually with something like “Would you work for free?”
    You say that they get a flat rate of $100. That is true, but only true for new cars, not used. If a salesman were to make a mere $100 or $200 a car, do you realize how many cars they would have to sell to make even a decent living? Far more than most dealerships push out each month. Used cars, on the other hand, are based purely on what that car sells for. They get a percentage of what the profit margin is on the car. Therefore, of course they want to make the dealership money so they can get their 20%-30%. They do need to make a living.

    3. Car Salesmen often will say “Theres just not that much profit”
    Honestly, there’s not. New cars don’t matter because the price is pretty much set from the particular dealership. Take, for example, a Ford Focus that has an MSRP of 12,500. A dealership will only sell it to you for 13,000. That sounds pretty reasonable to me considering all of the cost associated with the costs that you fail to mention such as the cost of the salesman, the manager, the finance manager, and the people in the office that have to do the accounting. There are a lot of things that a dealership has to do behind the scenes that people don’t realize.

    4. Some will say “I’m an honest guy trying to make an honest living”
    It’s a job. Like any job, the people have to make money. Overall, most dealerships will be fair with you. It is, after all, a business. Don’t expect that you are going to get an amazing deal, but you should know enough about the process to not get taken advantage of, either.

    So really, stop being such a sensationalist.

  15. doublsh0t Says:

    On Youtube, there’s a video of a guy named Rob Gruhl who gave a fantastic 5 minute fast-paced presentation on “how to buy a new car and not get screwed”. I thought it had some good substance…


    (btw i, too, saw this blog through digg)

  16. Patrick Says:

    Having worked in dealerships far too much in my life (parts) You are so right. There are allot of good people trying to make an honest living there. (fixed ops) The problem is they are invaribly run by former sales managers promoted to G.M. They are almost all corporations now, very few family owned dealerships left. “Anyone who has any morals would not work in this industry.” This is exactly how I feel. I pray I will never have to work for these scumbags again.Thanks for the insight on your life. I know how you feel. Keep plugging away, brainstorm those income streams and thanks for the inspiration.

  17. Vincent Says:

    This was funny and mostly true. However, I take serious offense to your last comment. My father is a used car salesman and has been for about 15 years now. He works on his own, not for a dealership. There is nothing dishonest about him. Sure, you say I’m defending him because he’s my father, but you can’t make a statement like that when it’s simply not true. This man goes to auctions 3 days a week, works at a mortgage company, buys, fixes, and sells houses, he used to own 4 video stores, and at age 63 he works over 90 hours a week, every week of his life. He’s easily the most hardworking person I’ve ever known, as he is wise and honest.

    I’ve met and come to know several people that he’s worked with in the car business. Sure, a lot of them are scumbags. I know it, and he knows it. That doesn’t mean all of them are. I’ve met plenty of car salesman that are very decent people. Just like any sales job, there are those that are not just in it for the money, but genuinely like getting people what they need. I’ve worked in sales for Hewlett Packard, and regardless of what our company rules were, I never upsold customers to things they didn’t need. I always asked for budget first and wouldn’t think to go a penny over it unless I knew the customer simply could not get what they wanted otherwise. I gave discounts when it would cost me commission. And honestly, I really did feel good when I sold somebody a product that I knew they would enjoy, that satisfied their needs, and more importantly, when I knew I did the best I could on the price.

    So, please, even though you’re writing a nice, humorous article, think before you deface and turn the light-heartedness into ignorant sterotyping.

  18. steve Says:

    One of the most important reasons that the customer is treated shabbily is that all car salesmen are taught that they ONLY HAVE ONE CRACK at turning a prospect into a buyer. Which accounts for the increasing level of aggression in the deal.

    My personal negotiating tactic is to use Consumers Reports to determine the price of a car — and when the dealer asks me “how much Ican afford,” I reply, “Here’s what I am willing to pay.” It is always $1500 below their cost. Since I know that the owner will not give up the dealer holdback (2-5%) and the salesman always gets $100 — I have no sympathy or mercy for the salesman. If he does not immediately give me an answer, I tell him I must be dealing with the wrong guy — and ask for the salaried fleet manager. If this doesn’t work, wish them well in their new career and leave the dealership.

  19. Car Salesman Arguments, and Complaints | A Former Car Salesman and His Crusade Says:

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  20. mark rushworth Says:

    these arguments could be saidf of any industry. when i sell websites i often say the same things but as im selling my time i feel justified. ive even gone so far as to give a client the shirt off my back (literally) but would not give discounts.

    some of the shifty things that ive experienced is them keeping your(UK) car tax disk which you have every right to keep and claim back the unused time on and as they charge you for a new tax disk ontop grrrr

  21. Tyler Says:

    Man–this is ice cold. True in most instances, but I think you overshot the line with “Anyone who as any morals would not work in this industry.” I had to work that shit job for years when my wife was knocked up. It was the only job that I could get at the time where I could make more than $50K to support her and my child (and not be a college grad). Granted, I left the industry as soon as I could, but there was some great people there. I (and others) always did operate with the customers best interests in mind and heart. I figured that someone was going to screw them over and I wanted to steer them clear of “butcher shops”. My deal was $200 over invoice, every time. With that sales model, I was averaging over 30 cars a month, and happy to collect a flat (150) and unit bonuses from the management. Can’t call it a batch batch for a couple of burnt cookies, dude. I still handle every vehicle purchase for friends, co-workers, family, etc. Bluntly sir, I don’t know if you can make an acidic statement like that because it throws your morals into the ring. Judge not lest ye be judged. Shit, and I’m not even religious…..

  22. Car Salesman Arguments, and Complaints | A Former Car Salesman and… — All About Hyundais Says:

    […] Read the rest of this great post here […]

  23. Jay Says:

    You sir, are a fucktard.

  24. Delvin BarDukay Says:

    We really could cut all this out entirely by selling cars direct from the manufacturer at the sticker price wholesale to customers at reasonable prices. Cut out the middleman altogether. As for used cars, we can just sell them directly ourselves online.

    There are some types of businesses or services we absolutely need. We need nurses, we need teachers, but we don’t necessarily need car salesmen. There is a high demand for people to be able to buy cars at reasonable prices like they buy goods at Walmart, so its only a matter of time before someone changes the entire industry and cuts out the middleman altogether. One day there will be no more ‘car salesman’ like there are today.

  25. Mark Says:

    I agree with most of the complaints about the article.

    I work in a different part of sales, different industry, and I wouldn’t advise using these kinds of arguments on either side of the fence. Both the dealership and salesman need to make money, as well as the buyer needs to buy a reasonably priced car.

    The best and only honest way is to shop around to a few different dealerships and see what you can pay elsewhere. Approach your favourite one (in terms of the quality of people) and see if they can match the best price or come close enough. Forget any notion of whether it’s ‘fair’ or not how much someone makes.

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  27. car person Says:

    You are way WAY off on profits for a new vehicle. I work for a major auto manufacturer and a dealer’s profits per unit sold on a typical 16,000 to 25,000 car is rarely RARELY over $1000. It is, in fact, typically only a few hundred dollars. Where a dealer gets you is DOCUMENTATION FEES (rip-off), extra warranties, and add-ons (pin stripes, undercoating, rust proofing, etc).

  28. Jon Says:

    Ignorant, incomplete article. But you got your day on DIGG.

    Straw man BS that gets you NO closer to owning a car.

  29. MIke Says:

    You sir are a fucking idiot.

  30. Anonymous Says:

    uh, I use the line, “I don’t have to buy a car from you”. that sets the mood and I also look at my watch a few times, I tell them I have another appointment to meet and there’s a car dealership I told my friend I would meet them at. this helps get them rolling.

    never go to just one car dealership and if you do buy the car, have them fill the tank up and give you an extra key.

    I also tell them that they make more money on used cars and if I don’t like the deal they are giving me, I stand up and tell them, no thanks.

  31. Obvious Says:


    And it’s been that way forever. Any product that needs a saleman (milk & eggs don’t need a salesman) means that there’s some “convincing” to do.

    At age 55, I’ve been dealing with salesman in my personal and professional life for the past 40 or so. There is no such thing as an “honest” salesman. They have to lie to themselves in order to face themselves each morning hence this seemingly small subset of “good guys”. It is NOT a generalization to say ALL SALESMEN ARE DISHONEST any more than to say that snow is cold and rain is wet.

    Yes, car salesmen are opportunistic, blood sucking leeches. NOW shall we discuss insurance salesmen?

  32. Mark Says:

    I loved it. You can read the people who “take offense” or call it a lie. Clearly they or one of their relations are dealers. Screw ’em. Went into a dealership with the invoice info and indicated that I would pay a reasonable profit on the car. By the way, the initial dealer profit is usually furthered by a volume profit from the car company after sale, factory to dealer incentives and rebates (carbuyingtips.com). So if the guy took the offer he would have made the profit in about 5 min. I knew what car, willing to take the color on the lot, no other haggling on my part. He told me that my price was too low. I apologized for bothering him and stated that I was going to shop at another dealer who may take my offer. He asked me to stay. Continued to discuss price. I politely told him I wasn’t going to pay more. Stated I would leave at anytime if it didn’t work for him and the dealership. He showed me numbers. I showed him mine. He told me they were wrong. I told him I would be fine leaving then to shop around. He wanted to get his supervisor. I told him “fine, but it will not change my price”. Supervisor told me that I wasn’t going tom make any friends being so stubborn. Told him I had plenty of friends, I wanted to buy a car. Repeated my comment that I would leave at anytime. He wanted to get manager. Won’t change my price I said. Finally after 90 minutes, rude behavior on their part, and strong arming, they sold me the car at my price. This is much closer to buying a house than milk. If you are the idiot who pays the asking price on a house then feel free to slam me. One more thing. When my wife came in to sign the final papers (it was going to be her car) they convinced her that she had to get insurance because it was financed. Added $3000 dollars to a 15,000 car for equivalent insurance. Fortunately I cancelled within 48hours. Honest car dealers are not easy to find. If you think you found one trust but verify.

  33. Nathan Says:

    The people who write thes articles are the one’s that have been ripped off. Your just upset that you got ripped off that is why you need to tell people that the car industry is so bad. Get a life, and if you don’t like dealerships buy from a private party. (Just remember if you do, you have no warranty and no one to complain to when the car has problems.)

  34. car buyer Says:

    to all those who take offense at this article… if you dont do any of the above mentioned tactics, then it DOES NOT apply to you. geez!

  35. Cory Says:

    I’m tired about hearing about poor little car salesman and how customers treat them so badly and make stereotypical accusations of them. I think the whole car dealer industry should go away. I should be able to order exactly what I want from the manufacturer and not have to pay a middle man to “help” me choose a car I want. I’d rather buy a car the same way I buy a new house–I’m not going to spend thousands on something you just happen to have laying around because its “close” to what I want.

  36. Da truf Says:

    I’ve sold cars before when I was between jobs. This article is pretty much correct. The majority of people in the car business have no morals. I say the majority, not all. There are a few exceptions. It is true that there is a much smaller profit margin in new cars than used. The dealerships usually have factory incentives that the sales people aren’t even aware of. Oh, by the way, my brother has been a finance manager, sales manager and general manager of car dealerships for the last 30 years.

  37. blowme Says:

    fk off

  38. Jason P Says:

    Isn’t it funny how offensive the truth is sometimes? Look at how mad these people are. Yes, contrary to what you believe the MAJORITY of the industry operates this way. No I’ve never been burned, because I know how to handle these people, I used to be one. $200 over invoice is absurd. You see the dealership not only screws the customer, they screw the salesman too. With a “pack” and a “shop bill” its all nonsense. Thanks to EVERYONE reading!

  39. Wow Says:

    As far as I’m concerned you should do everything you can to get the best deal you can. That being said, it’s amazing how many sales people have come on here to say how honest the are. Really. Please believe them. I’ve got a bridge to sell ya while your at it. They will ALWAYS make a profit, otherwise they would have been out of business long ago. If there’s room to negotiate that just means they’re making more money than they need to. And quit frankly I don’t give a f-…, I don’t care if you make a profit or hell even if you make a living. Its not my responsibility to keep you in business, it is my responsibility to get the best deal I can so I can improve the quality of my own life. Oh well, let the salesmen bitch. If they were GOOD salesmen their arguments would be more convincing than “Oh Noes! I would never lie to you!”

  40. Amar Says:

    Just bought a car, guy bitched and bitched about how he cant go below invoice cause he loses money and that would not make sense until he finally sold it to me 1400 below their invoice.

  41. GDC Says:

    Bill, you’re a douche for taking offense at the article, be offended you called your dad and honest salesmen. I know former convicts (my uncle) who sold cars and left because the morality in it was low. The article is ok, I wanted to hear more real inside stories and stats on what is profited. I think there is also a glaring lack of the most important part of buying a car, best tip ever . . . here it is . . . NEVER TALK MONTHLY PAYMENT! Talk price. Second, if you are shy, easily turned, or a weak willed person, take you friend the asshole with you to talk for you.

  42. Bah Says:

    I’ve purchased my last two cars using the same technique, and both times I believe it has saved me a lot.

    I send out an early morning fax with exact specs on what I want to all dealerships within 250 miles. The options, the colors, etc. I tell them in the fax that I am sending this out to all dealerships within 250 miles and I am looking to make a purchase TODAY. I ask them to fax me back a quote by noon. Bottom line is he with the best price on the exact set of features I want gets my business that very day.

    The last time I did this, I sent out 20 faxes. I got back 15 replies, two of which were not exact matches. Of the 13 remaining, the price differences were quite surprising (to me, at least) and there was a range of about $5k (this was for a Denali XL fully loaded).

    Best price turned out to be about 50 miles away. I called them up and told them to prep the car and paperwork and that I was coming in to pick it up. Got to the dealership and left with the new car in about 30 minutes.

  43. Anonymous Says:

    I dont Like carsales man as much as the next guy, but realize that the percentage of markup is low on cars, relative to the total price paid. Clothing has markups of over 100 % on my high end clothing, Cars however have less than a 10% markup, its just more money due to a higher price. In addition not all carsales men are evil people, they are just like anyone else just trying to make a living. It people who come in and start arguements and fight to save 100 dollars that piss them off. Honestly, people should just learn to accept things for what they are and stop bitching

  44. Scott Says:

    Blah blah blah … bottom line, if they thought they could sell the car for more to the next guy, they will. Once you get toward medium luxury market (BMW 3 series, etc), car sales people will do it to you often. I’ve had many offers flat out refused, and negotiations cut off because they didn’t want to waste their time on me.

    Conversely, if they want to sell a car, they will negotiate. It’s all about timing and inventory.

    Their job isn’t to give you the item at the lowest price they can. Their job is to sell the item for the highest profit. There’s nothing immoral about that, so I wish people would quit whining about it and man up on their negotiation skills. Play the game, have fun with it; don’t take it so personally. And if you go in without all your facts straight and get screwed on the trade/financing/add-ons then you really don’t have anybody else to blame but yourself.

    Best thing to do is find a sales person that you connect with. If you don’t, it’s going to be a rough ride.

    I buy a lot of cars, one every year to two years. Sometimes I’ve had to pay full msrp for a hot new model, other times I’ve gotten a car for way under invoice. You just have to do your homework and know what the market will bear.

  45. Richard Says:

    I sold cars for 25 years. Made a very good living at it. Most of my income came from repeat or referral customers. The last 13 years in used cars exclusivly. Why? Becasue I got tired of having to kiss peoples asses to sell them a new car and make $100. If you didn’t pucker up, you were faced with a negative CSI score. Screw that. People are so concerned about what a dealer makes on a car. Look at it this way. a Honda dealer takes a 5 year old Accord in on tarde. he values it at $10,000. Puts it through his sho, cahrges RETAIL rates to himself, and after oil change, tires, maybe fix a scratch, etc. He now has $11,500 invested in this car. If I go to the auction, buy this lease return from a bank for $8000, pay HALF of what the dealer pays for reconditioning, and I have $8750 invested in the car. The dealer sells it for $12,500 and makes a thousand. I sell it for $12,000 and make $3750. Did my customer get screwed? NO. Why is that such a probelm? People are and arent stupid at the same time. If they hve done a minimal amount of reserach, they know that $12,000 is a better deal then $12,500. I see absolutely nothing wrong with “How much do you want for that car?’ and having the answer being whatever you are asking for it. That is your price, so what? If you were selling your car yourself, and someone agreed to your asking price, have you ripped them off? Of course not.

    Get off of car salesman.

  46. Dylan A Says:

    I earned a double degree while earning it at one of the nations top dealerships. It’s easy, and sometimes fair, to pick on car salesman, but all the cool terms and numbers of posts like this usually miss the big picture.

    You’re an idiot, if the profit margin the salesman is working with is only GROSS profit, the difference between the cost (no that cost is not on the paperwork you’ll ever see) and sticker. That difference is 500-$8000 ($8,000 is for a luxury car, the highest sellers are between 500-1500 at the very top end). It’s also important to note how much difference this REALLY makes in the per/month cost of a leveraged $20-50k asset. The biggest roadblock is people thinking that taking a huge chunk out of the profit will equal a significant savings every month when in reality it’s a single digit rounding error.

    You also ignored the biggest factor that really drives this: the first and second words you hear in an Econ class; SUPPLY AND DEMAND. All those fancy numbers and terms mean little compared to the COLOR that everyone wants on the MODEL everyone wants. If your preferences are part of a crowd, you will simply have to pay to get them- game over.

    Treat people like people… and ignore the few dollars it costs to do so. Being fair to yourself and the people will work with on the deal and focus on the BIG issues: fair price for you, the dealership that serves you, and THE product you are happy with.

    Working from the info on this post will give you a few good lines to sound cool and if your buying an 80k ride, maybe savings of $30/month. Hardly helpful. Info like this is what confuses the hell out of clients and causes a lot more problems than it helps.

  47. Brandon Says:

    I’ll leave this short. First: of course, it’ll be people that were, or people with relatives that were, in the industry who will try to defend it. They’re the only ones who actually know what happens there, for Christ’s sake! Second, sorry to burst your bubble. It actually isn’t easy for the car salesmen to make it. My brother tried for over a year. The dealership he was at took off $200 a month per car under a certain amount that he didn’t sell. He didn’t have the power, nor does anyone under the manager, to give the customer a discount. If you want something taken off of the sticker price, you are going to either: A) get your salesman in trouble, or B) talk directly to the manager. But, as I said: my brother’s in a different line of work now. Couldn’t handle it.

    Oh, I wonder what this author’s credentials are. Expert car buyer or something? Did you just come home having to pay $500 less on your car or something? Grats!

  48. Why Car Salesmen Think its Okay to Screw you, And what you can do about it! « irrevocable stuff Says:

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  49. Jason P is an idiot Says:

    Having spent about a year trying out car sales I can say the people span the spectrum just as in all fields. Some of these arguments are ridiculous. When you finish beating down the deal the salesman, who has probably put in several hours on it, makes a $100 “mini” commission. Jason’s suggestion about how the guy isn’t working for free because he gets paid wages etc. is stupid based on what the guy makes off those deals. There are others just as ridiculous. The fact is, the salesman is trying to make a living like anyone else and works within the parameters available. Those are all in favor of the dealer. Jason, man up and when you beat down the next guys deal know you’ve pulled all the money out of his pocket and hand him an extra hundred. He’s earned it for putting up with you and you’ll still be way ahead of the deal that would have paid him $200 through the dealership.

  50. RLY? SRLY? Says:

    I work with dealers on the internet side of the business. My job is to make them more money selling their vehicles online. Is profit a dirty word? If you were selling your car, would you take less because your a nice guy? If you would.. Email me, I’d like to buy your car and I’ll flip it for the profit you should have sold it for to begin with.

    Here is where your logic is flawed. Lets say I am a car salesman and I have the car you want. Do you think I should give you my lowest price right off the bat? Why would I do that? It doesn’t make any sense. The first rule in negotiations is you can always go down but you can never go up.

    The only customers that get “high grossed” these days are “ups” that walk in cold, customers to lazy to research pricing, and those with subprime credit . If you are any of these then you are going to get you head taken off at the table.

    The car industry is not what it use to be. The internet produces a better informed consumers. The statistic is that 75-80% of customers will goto the internet to do research first before they ever call a dealer. With a nationwide market place like eBay or autotrader dealers don’t have a option on being competitive. To many wholesalers are flooding the markets with 1k grosses. So what’s a dealer to do? They make their money on trade ins.

    Car dealers are like 3 year olds, they are only going to do what you let them get away with.

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  52. anonymous Says:

    As for anyone discussing “invoice” pricing, there’s a 2-5% holdback/bonus from the factory to incentivize a dealer to sell more cars. $200 above invoice is bunk, as the invoice price is also bunk. take a look at http://www.carbuyingtips.com for good info.

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  54. Matt D Says:

    If the dealers were smart they would install Internet kiosks right inside the dealership, to order the car. The next person the customer encounters is the manager who is the end of the chain. The price is negotiated on the spot from the information that the customer inputted. There is your “no middle man.”
    Customers could browse the lot, then use the machine when they are ready to start the buying process. Less haggling, one person to deal with, less labor cost for the dealer (less salesmen). Then use some of the savings to make car sales more lucrative for the salesmen there.
    If the salesmen were compensated differently, the honesty/ethics issues may change for the better.

  55. REAL CAR MAN Says:

    Do you guys realize what car salesman do for the economy? If you take out the “middle man” who would get you financed with your bad credit.(75% of the people). we work long and hard to get you financed, get the right car for you, and handle all of the dmv stuff that i’m sure you don’t want to do. By playing games and asking for 1000.00 behind cost aren’t you being a dishonest slime yourself. How many of you have actually lied to a dealership? (think about it) — I have a meeting to get to and only have 5 minutes…… REALLY , then why did you stop to get a price if you only have five minutes. Car salesman aren’t stupid, we can see the fear in your eyes, we see how you get nervous, You act like jerks because you simply don’t know how to negotiate. I wonder how many of your jobs are affected by the car industry, The #1 industry in the world.

  56. comsarmdrerve Says:

    I’d prefer reading in my native language, because my knowledge of your languange is no so well. But it was interesting!

  57. The car blog » Why Car Salesmen Think its Okay to Screw you, And what you can do about it! Says:

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  59. Overthetop Says:

    Well I guess everyone will get screwed when the price of cars is fixed and no one will be able to haggle. All your information will be as useless as you are. Even you will have to pay sticker and none of your crap will matter. Now what? It’s coming, pure pricing, and your trade is now worth what it’s worth!!! Sorry folks it’s just not worth as much as you think it is. Now what, I only make minimum wage to tell you this or oh’ my god a whole $100 bucks for putting up with your shit!!! Stop crying over spilled milk. The only reason your writing these stupid articles is because you couldn’t make it green pea. Blog you!!!!

  60. Ryan Says:

    Why don’t all you people who know so much about the car business and how much they make go sell cars. Go see how hard it is to make a living at $100 per car sale. Then listen to every customer tell you that you are making lots of money on the transaction. If car salesmen were making the money this tard is saying he would still be doing it.

  61. comsarmdrerve Says:

    I’d prefer reading in my native language, because my knowledge of your languange is no so well. But it was interesting! Look for some my links:

  62. Ga. Car Salesman James Says:

    You guys honestly have no clue. Car salesmen are probably the most shit on proffession in the world. I mean think about it. Right from the start we have to fight for every penny we make and to top it all off if we don’t sell 15- 20 cars a month we can’t even survive. I don’t know about you guys but the last time I checked even selling 5 cars a week which is extremely hard to do in most cases, that still only leaves us with about 26k a year. So tell me what in the hell you think you know?
    I work my ass off for my customers and in three years have never had a customer complaint. I think you need to start reading all the reports. Yes there some shady people in car sales. But how many you have somebody you work with that you think is shady?
    You go on a car lot with the intention of getting as much money as you can taken off of the car. How is what I do any different? I try to keep as much money as I can I have a family to feed to. And by the way last time I checked every person that buys a car sits down with a finance manager and goes over ALL paperwork. How can I screw you if you honestly read the paperwork and agreed to the deal. No one forces people to buy anything. Car buying in this day and age is almost more of a necessity than your damn milk so be sure you know what you are talking about when you put it out there.

  63. True SalesMan Says:

    Ahem… I sell cars for a living… I just wanted to let you all know that, AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! I still will make a killing off of you, wether you use this advice or not! And the funny thing is, you will NEVER know how!!! HAHA!! THanks for your HONEST efforts though! I know more car salesmen than you’ll ever meet in your pathetic little lives, and I can honestly tell you, you people lie more to us than we will ever think of doing to you… I don’t have to lie to you! I know that the average American CONSUMER has less morals than I have in my little pinky. Oooooh. Beware of the car salesmen, be scared, be very afraid, cause we’re all out to get you! We are not humans, we don’t have families to feed, we haven’t lived lives that brought us to the points we are at where we need to sell cars to make a decent living, we are CRABPEOPLE!!! You idiots need to get a life, cause you moaning and complaining on the internets is going to get you so far in life it’s about as pathetic to take a half a second to think about as your lives already obviously are! Give me a break.

  64. Phil Says:

    Passing through and wanted to say hello

  65. The Auto Insider Says:

    Unfortunately the auto industry has brought these type of articles on themselves! People expect to be treated badly or fleeced of thousands of dollars every time they enter a dealership. People do not feel this way about entering a grocery store. It is sad.

    The Auto Insider
    Insider Car Buying Tips

  66. Doodee Says:

    Thanks for sharing

  67. keith Says:

    that salesman oh sorry the true salesman if he’s so worried about us wasting our lives why is he on this site. bitch punk he’s mad cuz he knows the internet is killing him and websites like this oh and thank you man ruin all the bullshit he’s trying to feed the average person what a piece a shit to do that to people drug game one word dead

  68. Sophia Says:

    Alright, so bring a salesperson first off I have to say this.

    BUYERS are the liars. It’s amazing how many people lie to us everyday, I’m just going to get a coffee to think about it, what time are you open until tomorrow? I’ll be back in at 4. They’ll book appointments with you knowing it’s your day off, but you’re coming in anyways to help them, but then don’t show up.

    Someone walks into a dealership, they want a car. It’s that simple. It’s our job to sell it to you. I would rather have a customer that comes in, says straight up ‘I want this, Im paying this for it’ and go from there. If I only make a flat fee off of it, fine. But if I have to waste HOURS of my time… with some asshole, who doesn’t want to test drive, doesn’t want to even look or sit in the vehicle, but wants my ‘best price’ so that he can go shop me, and go buy from someone else in the end… that’s where you get salespeople who are defensive and ‘lie’ although if you were actually intelligent you would notice that the majority of sales people don’t ‘lie’ they just outsmart you. I don’t need to lie to anyone, I can however bypass one of your stupid questions.

    Furthermore, the people who keep coming back, and are referring people, are NOT the asshole’s who ‘got the best deal’. They are the people who saw the value in the vehicle, maybe paid a little more for it, but are happy with their purchase. The people who ALLOWED us to do our jobs, demonstrate and present the features and benefits, allowed us to build rapport, and show that we’re not the scum of the earth. And those are the people who get the best service, because they allow us to do our jobs.

    I like people who deal straight, if you tell me you want to buy a vehicle right now, for a certain price, I’ll do my best to make it work for you. But fuck you if you’re going to play stupid games, pin one dealership on another. Just pick a fucking car, tell me what I can do to get you into that new car. And go on your merry way. Don’t waste my fucking time.

    It’s not about money, it’s about building relationships, and I love my job… on all of the days that I DONT come across asshole’s like you.

  69. trey Says:

    i think pretty much everyone here agrees on the fact that this article is horribly flawed.a major reason poor jason had a bad encounter with a car salesman is becasue he expected the salesman to bend at his will and drop the price of the car to whatever he desired. when he was disappointed he illogically assumed all car salesman are spawns of satan. stupid

  70. Anonymous Says:

    To all you “Smart Shoppers” with your consumer reports magazines, and research who think you got the Best deal, just keep thinking that, you folks are my favorite “Marks”, while you’re boasting about how out smarted the car salesman to all your friends and posting it here, Im laughing all the way to the bank……LULZ

    So keep reading your Consumer Reports and blogs about outwitting us, You never Will!!!!!!!

  71. stevee0506 Says:

    I also have few bad and good experiences with the sales man which i have encountered…..Being a car enthusiast i have faced n number of incidences in my life…….. http://www.buyingadvice.com/

  72. jeroen Says:

    Thanks for your project. I like this site. KEEP IT UP..

  73. Romona Wyatt Says:


  74. Adam Watson Says:


  75. Clair Blithe Says:

    This is why i never go to the car dealerships anymore.
    I had a really bad experience once in my city ( Toronto )
    at Yorkdale volkswage, their service was awful and i found out later they were using a used part in the repair of my car.

    I use http://www.youcarz.com for my car buying needs now. haha.

    Oh man. Forget going to the dealer, they will rob you blind, better off buying/ selling online

  76. Tom Says:

    I am a car salesman and we I work on commission. Meaning…If I don’t sell a car I make NO money..no base pay, no minimum wage, no nothing…and that’s how it is at most car dealerships. I don’t know where you get this information about us recieving a minimum payout from..carmax? The profit margin is greater…yes…but put it in this perspective, the average profit on a chevy (where i work) is $1000. Sounds like alot? The sales people get 25% commission….that comes out to $250…still sound like alot? Okay how about this…a salesman averages 2-3 cars a week….that’s 500-750 a week….mostly 500..that’s 2 grand a month you try living on 2 grand a month, it’s a lot harder than it seems.

  77. lenkaalech Says:

    I think the girl’s name is Cinderella, but i haven’t found any info about her.
    She either might have changed her name or she is out of the biz.

    This clip is worth the download.
    If you like skinny girls…this is the one!

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  78. jobbercypr Says:

    Good time, it’s a job offer. (Sorry if I post it in wrong place)

    Cyprus company is looking for a Campaign Executive to assist with fundraising, presentations, various administrative and sales management duties. If you have fundraising and sales experience, plus intermediate computer knowledge, this job is for you! Apply with us today!

    All applicants applying for U.S. job openings must be authorized to work in the United States. All applicants applying for European job openings must be authorized to work in European Union.

    We are growing advertising and consulting company offering job opportunities ranging from executive and administrative assistants to customer service representatives, receptionists and general support.

    NOTICE: we do not provide relocation, this position is online based, we are using progressive online administrative system. You will have to use a special online training program for free.

    Requirements and skills:
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  79. Attestefenirl Says:

    I’m new there
    Nice forum!

  80. Large Women Says:

    Big Girls are my favorite and I want to taste all of them!

  81. Anonymous Says:

    The bottom line is that if dealers were not trying to get the customer for all he was worth, they would simple fire all the salesmen and slap a reasonable price on the car. This would save everyone a lot of time and effort and eliminate an unnecessary salesman’s commission.

    With the internet, today most folks don’t need a salesman to explain options or generally hold their hand.

  82. rob Says:

    seriously… this is probably the worst post ever. i have owned 3 cars in my life. never once did i get haggled like this except when i bought private party. the people trying to get rid of their cars are the worst ones, lying pieces of shit… the profit on a 20,000 car is like maybe 2000 tops at msrp.now when people haggle and come in wanting a car at the price of what the dealer pays… let me tell you that pisses me off. no paycheck for the guy helping you out. i work in sales at a gym, the 7 day passes for the 300 pounders are a joke, they dont use them and then 2 months later come back with an order from the doctor that they are too fat. and still wont sign up!!!! its stupid…

  83. Your Honest Car Salesman Says:

    I just read your “Famous Carsalesman Crap”. This post is absolutely rediculous, this is BS stereo typing that has kept yourself in a position against carsalesman.

    I have been in sales for many years and in the past two years have been selling highline vehicles. You think you can just classify a couple arguments carsalemen have that, I for one, never see myself saying.

    We never argue that there is no profit to be made, I will tell you up front that I am making a profit but will make sure the buyer and seller are both happy with the profit made. You need to take a basic Economics class to understand that.

    The MSRP is set by the automaker so don’t give the salesman the well I know what the invoice is crap. The invoice IS the price which the dealership pays for the vehicle (not the consumer) and the MSRP is what the Manufacture’s retail price should be in a particular market.

    Will you pay MSRP for a vehicle? No, not unless it is a specialty vehicle that has a high demand and a low supply. This is where incentives come in, if they are a domestic company and the MSRP is $10,000 higher then the market says it should be then you will see a larger rebate or discount. If your company is a highline then most likely they are very close to the actual market value so don’t expect to pay invoice.

    We are honest men and woman who are trying to make a living just like yourself. The bottom line of working is to make money. The best carsaleman in the world know you can not take all of someones money and send them out in a car they do not like. Otherwise, they will never return to buy a vehicle from you (which referrals are what makes a Salesman longterm profits). You need to find a balance of a good profit for the salesman and the right car for the buyer and you will have a very good relationship that won’t make you look like the A*hole that some people feel they must be when purchasing a vehicle.

  84. WeigueAssuslY Says:

    Your welcome everyone,
    My PC worked slowly, many errors. Please, help me to fix errors on my PC.
    I used Windows XP.
    With best regards,

  85. DB Says:

    Listen, all of you, just listen. To Jason P: Sorry for knocking your head off buddy, haha I hope the salesman who cracked your skull open bought a car with the commission he made off your ass. I have been selling cars for a while, and I am here to say that honestly, people that work on commission get paid based on WHAT THEY SELL THE PRODUCT FOR!!! Bottom line is…do some research and then call to see if they can do that deal. I can’t tell you how many times I get a mysterious phone call from an educated buyer and then do the deal on the terms he/she proposed. It makes it easier on the salesman to just do the deal with no haggle, yea it might not be the biggest commission, but in the end its not what you make on each car individually, but, how many cars you can put over the curb in one month. With the new ways to research prices, finance rates, and rebates…if you dont do this research YOU SHOULD PAY STICKER. It is up to you to research before you buy and thats why often times I ask the customer: “Have you done any online research on the vehicle?” This clarifies whether the buyer is educated, if not…sorry buddy but I am gonna charge more. Also, I work for a domestic brand…80% of my customers have some type of employee or retiree discount which SETS THE PRICE FROM THE MANUFACTURER. Most cases I can give the customer the price and the VIN and they can call headquarters themselves to get the price again for reassurance sake. Also, EVERY BRAND HAS SOMETHING CALLED CSI OR CUSTOMER SERVICE INDEX. This is a survey sent to the customer within a couple weeks of their purchase. If these numbers are bad, or you get bad ratings, the dealer will lose money and the salesman will lose money and sooner or later probably lose their job.


  86. Why Car Salesmen Think its Okay to Screw you, And what you can do about it! « Hot Cars News, Pictures, Videos and more Says:

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  87. tvc3 Says:

    i am working 60 hours at 3 dollars below minimum and have not had a sale in 2 weeks…

  88. Bob Says:

    If the finance department at the dealership gets you to take a loan with them, then you probably overpaid. Many car dealerships make their money with financing. They “shop” their loans to big financial institutions and take a cut of the loan. Essentially the bank has to charge a higher interest rate to you.

    If this happened to you, then consider doing a car loan refinance. It’s fast, easy, and free. No costs to apply and no car appraisal fees. If you are paying more than 8% interest, then I’d say give it a try.

  89. J.T. Thompson Says:

    I have worked for Chrysler for 7 yrs.!!! And when I read this article, I have to ask, has the guy telling these stories ever worked as a car salesman? or has he seen an original invoice to any vehicle? probably not!!!! On any new car purchase there is minimal profit…..to all customers find out the rebates on the particular vehicle you are want ting to purchase then ask for the invoice subtract from the invoice price not the msrp and there is your best price….and i work in the internet dept. which we price our vehicles 1-3% less than invoice minus rebates!!!if you dont believe me call me and i will be more than happy to prove it!!!!!!!!!

  90. J.T. Thompson Says:


  91. J.T. Thompson Says:

    ohh I forgot profit and making money isnt a crime!!!!if that was true then ask our government why they take taxes out and we are left with net not gross and then after that charge another tax for every dollar you spend…..think about that before you toss rocks in a glass house

  92. Doug Says:

    I second what JT Thompson says. The gentleman who wrote this article is perpetuating myths that make car buyers viciously suspicious and car salesman want to kill themselves. I have been selling cars for two months and have never been treated worse by people in my life than I have by some of my customers. For one, yes, the average markup on a car is probably around 1000 dollars but the average price is around 25000. that’s a markup of four percent! Do you know how much of a markup there is in a latte! Furthermore, how many gallons of milk are sold compared to how many cars? A lot more. I guarantee the average grocery store brings in more revenue than the average car dealership.

  93. Frank Says:

    Wow. There is nothing wrong with making a profit on what you sell. Capitalism you retards. This is what our country is founded on. If you don’t like paying profit, stop buying things. The highest retail markup (by percentage in relationship to cost) is jewlery. Diamonds and gold especially. However, you don’t see people going in and haggling on the price of their watch or wedding set. P.S. that’s a luxury item, not food, you don’t need it. Those that complain about other people making money are the people that don’t make any. And hey, here’s a thought, if you don’t feel like you are getting a fair enough price on a car (which usually means you can’t afford it anyway and is the reason you are backing out of the deal being presented) then stop complaining and don’t buy it. PLEASE go find something better to do with your time than bitch about things on the internet.

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    Hi all! I have been selling cars for over ten years now and have come to the conclusion that I need people to hate and fear me. You see if every customer was truthful, nice, had good credit and was willing to pay a reasonable profit to the dealer say 5-8%, well then everybody would want to put on nice clothes and sell cars. And if that was the case then dealers would pay the salespeople 10 bucks an hour and then I would be forced to get an education and try to take my chances in another “professional” line of work in order to pay for the six bedroom house on a golf course that my family is privelaged enough to live on and to pay for my childrens college “which unfortuanately I wasn’nt given the chance to do as I found myself working from the ripe age of fifteen to support myself as my parents were too busy trying to kill themselves with drugs and alcohol.(Sorry to get off subject)Nope there would no money to be made in car sales if it werent for the stereotypes that all salespeople are scumbags and we should make sure to screw them out of a paycheck. So I would like to personally thank you inhuman bastards that treat us like sh&# because if there were none of you then my kids may have had less oppurtunities and I would not enjoy the financial blessing that the car biz has provided us.
    Now for those of you people who actually think we might be oridanary hard working people that have the honest desire to help you through what is considered to be one of the largest purchases you will ever make and are willing to make sure that we are rewarded for our efforts I thank you and rest assured nobody seeks employment of entering the biz because we are desperate to screw the public out of their hard earned cash. I will warn you though that because of people like the author of this post that many salespeople become jaded. But they are pretty easy to spot and steer clear of.Most dealers chase them off pretty quickly nowadays. But do yourself a favor and do your reasearch and ask to see the invoice as you assure your salesman (politely) that you wont be taken advantage of but also want to make sure his efforts will be rewarded.I personally believe $400 over invoice for every $10,000 worth of car is sufficient as it keeps me from getting my ass chewed for failing to do my job correctly and based off of current stats will provide me with a couple hundred bucks after taxes. And will keep me motivated to ensure you the highest quality of service.
    As for you grinders out there who expect me to kiss your ass and spend hours even days answering all of your questions and educating you about the cars and then expect that the store “mini” is plenty of money for my services when you know damn well isn’t enough unless I’m selling two cars a day everyday which is impossible in this economy, dont be surprised when you leave the dealership cussing mad because you ended up wasting a huge amount of time thinking you were about to make the deal of the century and then got laughed at four hours later on your way out. Oh and another thing, I will make sure and tell all of my friends at the other stores you are about to visit to watch out for you.

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  99. Brandon Says:

    This is a stupid article written by someone who obviously has never worked in an industry like the car industry. Maybe you should go and try to sell a car before you stick your foot in your mouth again.

  100. Nick Smith Says:

    You’re a twisted prick

  101. B Says:

    This article is written as if it was pulled from a “how-to” in 1970. Your perplexities of ways to get around “tactics” are awful. All you are encouraging is making more people think this industry is a bad one. There are bad Apples in every industry in existence. You want to talk about “making a deal”, maybe we should look at the tactics of Wall St over the last few years.
    Long story short, do good business with a good business. If they’re scumbags trying to put you together, then LEAVE. It’s Business Darwinism. I’m sick and tired of people trying to find ways to beat the car salesman. Do your own research, learn basic arithmetic and understand supply and demand.

  102. JD Says:

    Anyone that still bothers to go in to play four square with these economic dinosaurs deserves whatever bad deal that they get.

    Sheesh, people, it’s 2011 and you are still buying a car like your grandpa did?

  103. cruise Says:

    So obviously either A. You were a very weak salesperson and failed miserably at selling cars, if you were good at it you would still be doing it….or B. Got your head ripped off on a transaction which is your own fault for being ignorant and created this blog to air your complaints over something you have no control over like the automobile industry. Either way you are wasting your time and you are obviously a terrible negotiator and or salesmen. Car salesmen are not all bad people with no morals, shame on you for making an ignorant blanket statement like that.

  104. Danny Munguia Says:

    Nearly all of the things you state happens to be astonishingly appropriate and that makes me wonder why I hadn’t looked at this in this light before. This particular piece really did turn the light on for me personally as far as this subject matter goes. Nevertheless there is just one position I am not necessarily too comfortable with and while I try to reconcile that with the actual core theme of your point, permit me see what the rest of your visitors have to say.Well done.

  105. Anonymous Says:

    Hah ur an idiot..you know nothing about the car business my man..all you ppl reading this dont listen..he really has no idea wat goes into a car deal..and the reason I kno this is cause ur blaming the salesmen..the salesmen is jus a negotiator for the manager behind the desk so shut the fuck up and talk about something you know..if I sold you a car id rip you a new asshole..

  106. the one thats right Says:

    anyone that needs a car for employment to dotheir own job understands that buying a car is indeed a huge expense but try staying in your budget then you wont need to negotiate so much dumb ass take your mcdonalds check and shove it up your ass

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